The Client Zone Ep- 13


Hello and welcome to the Skills Provision podcast. On today's episode we are discussing the client zone. What is the client zone? What does it mean? Stay tuned and you'll find out. If you're new to the pod cast and haven't listened to us before, please make sure you like, share, subscribe, follow whatever you can do on whatever platform you're listening. On today's episode, there is myself, Francesca. I'm Chris. I'm Pete, and he's done here also. Brilliant. So first of all, what is the client zone and where did it come from? Let's go back and start where it first of all developed. So Pete, obviously you're heavily involved in leading, often the development side of things. Where did the client zone originate from? What was the idea behind it? Not 100% sure. I believe the initial idea was born from a conversation with Chris that the skills provision business had to have a unique set of services to offer the employer, which at that time we didn't have. So very much like traditional recruitment agencies, get a client, start collecting cvs. We wanted to grow, develop, offer more strings to our bow and become a leading player, international recruitment. So a lot of work was needed and a lot of thoughts needed to be put into is one thing saying we want to develop, we want to introduce, we want to innovate in what areas, how, why and what probably the most important with the client zone. I guess for me the most important part is me as a person and my unique position at skills provision. Being that I am different to everyone else here primarily in terms of I am not a recruiter and don't really carry out many do different tasks in recruitment but don't actually do the recruitment process and my job, which is a difficult one, is to service the needs of the recruiter, job seeker and employer and at times, which is probably the most difficult part, not favoring any party or favoring the party dependent on what I am working on at that time. Because I work with and surrounded by recruiters, they voice their needs constantly and I have to listen. The employer and job seekers don't have a voice internally within the organization so that in itself is challenging. And when I'm working on areas where the recruiters see no value to them, it can be problematic, especially in conceptual design. So I looked at, I didn't probably think of needed to have what I sort of started off was looking at. The problem is if I was the employer, what would I want out of someone like skills provision and how could they best service my needs if I was very busy had a lot of openings, busy HR departments, how could I best be serviced? And that sort of started the idea of sort of first version of the client zone, which was to document, it's to keep everything in one place. So the zone part of the client zone, and to then have everything logically set and then secure, branded to the client's company and everything laid out. So their task was one of log in, see the people that have been put before me, and then collaborate with the recruit account managers in terms of moving forward thereafter, which has sort of grown as time's gone on. The theory of the client zone was strong, it needed to be tested. And then when it started being tested and used properly, the employers hr were very impressed, and rightly so, because probably one of the only agencies in the world that in this area 100% puts the employer 1st, 100%. And this is how you develop strong systems. But like I say, it is challenging, because I work for people that want me to work for their benefit. And I understand that, yeah, it is a massive balancing act and it's sometimes, to use an expression, isn't. It's robbing Peter to pay Paul, because what balances or adds value to one other might then have a negative impact on the other side. But then they all kind of come round again. But I think one word I personally would say has been missed and I don't know whether it was what was again, a driving thought between you and Chris when it came to it is collaborative, and I think that's what we always use when people, if you were to just say the client zone, well, it may not mean anything to someone unless obviously you're a client of ours, but it is a collaborative piece of software. Would you not agree, Chris, and the purpose behind it? I would. And it started off as a humble spreadsheet to try and sort out the chaos of recruitment. And you have paperwork everywhere and you can easily get lost in the communications stage internally and externally. And we were sending much to greater volume of emails to clients with sensitive information that we decided would be much better if it was contained within an internal system. And what has developed from a humble spreadsheet a few years ago is a much more sophisticated system today, which is being built on a regular basis. And clients have to be educated in the benefits of the client zone. Some just don't want to know and that's fine, that's their right. But others, when they start to use it ironically, it's our bigger clients that get the most benefit from it because they have been prepared to listen to us and to invest the time in learning how to use the system, which to be honest, is not a complicated system. No. And to be honest, that actually then leads me on to, and I'm kind of going to flip this around as to where I was going next about educating those that are using it. And Dan, you're included on these demos. And Chris, obviously Pete, you're not necessarily privy to these as much, but what we all do in our demonstrations and technical demonstrations, which was covered on previous podcast, go check that out, is that we will explain about how we go through the entire recruitment process culminating into this area, the client zone, and why it is such an important tool in our employer's arsenal, and that it allows them access to the information about said candidate. We'll call them Joe blogs and all their surrounding information about them and allowing us to then add our additional information, which we'll come on to that more in a bit. But Dan, from your perspective, obviously you've been in recruitment for quite a long time. How do you find the client zone and the response you get with individuals or employers rather, with regards to the client zone? Well, the client zone is a very useful tool for everyone involved, and that's for us as recruiters and for the clients as well. As Chris said before, it's not always perceived as that, as a very, well, very good tool, very useful tool. But once they are getting with it, then yeah, they are using it very much. And for me it's just like cutting the time in half for communicating with the clients. Exactly. And it acts as a good point of reference for things. And I think again, there has been some real progress and updates on systems and things like that, which we'll come on to. But what I would say with the client zone, it's ironic and actually I haven't really thought about it, that it is those bigger clients where they do have those multiple vacancies or a high volume of candidates that definitely have benefited the most from it. Now, in terms of the client zone, obviously we appreciate podcast. This is audio, you're not going to be seeing any visuals, but I'll try and describe this in the best way I can. Feel free. Anyone jump in when I'm discussing these things. Now, the basis of the client zone is, as Pete rightly said, a zone where the client has access and what do they have access to. So in this current time of recording, it is normally surface level details about the candidate, supplemented by a cv, additional documentation depending on what is requested by the client. So this could be copy of identity, if it's relevant, a copy of a driving license, certifications, references, any additional qualifications or documents that are needed to perhaps do the job. So say you were a dentist. It may be that you need the bachelor's of dental videos of work and photos of work or introductory videos. Now this is something I think we've talked about in previous podcasts, has been a real game changer for us, especially in the international side. Being able to showcase not only the paperwork of someone, but the person themselves. Anything you think I've missed as far as that goes in terms of. I think if you add in the added complexity of cross border recruitment and the fact that Dan can speak about a situation that he's working on in a minute where the client didn't like the client zone, didn't use the client zone was basically a bit of a pain in the backside from our point of view until such time as they had a problem in the recruitment process and now they use the client zone all the time. So I won't mention names and please don't mention any names, Dan, when you describe it, but that's a typical type situation. But when you think you could be moving people from Africa to the Middle east or from Asia to Europe, then the complexity of modern international recruitment is much greater than it used to be. And pictorial evidence, either with photographs or with videos, really does help. As I say to all the candidates when interviewing them before they go into the client zone, is when you talk to the client, you are interviewing them as much as them interviewing you. You use the client zone opportunity with the client to ask all your questions. And it's like a forum between the candidate and the ultimate employer. Yeah. With regards to a video, it gives them a chance to ask some questions. Dan, did you want to chip in there? Yeah, I would see it more as a bridge, as a form between the candidates and the end clients, as they have the possibility through us, of course, to upload videos, photos and everything else. People were saying that a photo is saying more than 1000 words. Now having in view this, a video is saying more than 10,000 words. So it more appreciates by the clients a video than a picture. No, there were times before when the clients didn't like to use this line zone. They were finding it like a hard rock to move on. And I was spending like hours and hours and hours only to present candidates, introduce, organize interviews and so on. And now it's all in a click. I can say. Exactly. And I like that word you use there, bridge. It is a bridge. It's connecting. We are the people in control of. I suppose it's a bit like a canal bridge. And obviously, I don't know if canals exist in every part of the world, but we are responsible in some ways for that lock and allowing the candidates to move through that process. And then the client is on the other side and we control that flow of people going through to the client zone. And obviously we want to get as many people as we can in there. Yes, Pete, I wasn't going to say anything. I just turned my microphone off. Okay, so in terms of additional information that we also then add, because a lot of our clients are looking for multiples, something else that we do is add additional comments and introductions, if you will, to candidates and supplement these with two scores. Our two scores generally are an english score giving a scoring out of ten. And the reason we do this is just purely based on interview or our conversation with them with regards to giving them a score for their english, or it can be supplemented in some cases, especially when we're dealing with the international side, people moving, if they have a score from a approved provider such as ielts or selt, and then the other score that we give is an overall suitability rating. Now, the overall suitability rating is how we feel that they match, and this is our interpretation of how we feel that a candidate matches with an employer's job description, their requirement, perhaps the things that they've said to us that aren't in that job description, how we think that they fit, not only just with their skill set, but how they've performed in the interview, the additional qualifications, they may have supplementary things, and again, giving that score, so these benchmark scores, and then having these displayed so that they can look in. And if you are, as you say, one of the opening things you said, pete, was that the idea is to ease the burden for our busy clients, that they can look and go, okay, well, I can see there's ten in here. I see that they've scored these three particularly highly. I'll look at those three first. Now, it's not to say we're always right, because the client knows what they're looking for. And obviously we get a feel for a business, but we're not in that business day in, day out. But what we can do is offer our professional opinion based on that. A candidate may not be 100% of it and very unlikely that any candidate is, but they can have the right additional skills and it gives us a chance to supplement that with additional comments, additional information and one of my personal things that I find of benefit for me or what I think about from the employer's perspective in the client zone is having them all in front of them in one easily viewable system means that no one gets overlooked. Whereas if you're sending people across email, say, CV by CV, well, they could easily overlook someone, miss someone, or only look at the most recent person. So for me, I think it gives the candidates the best opportunity as well, whether they know it or not. I would say historically there was an over reliance on emails in recruitment. As we know, emails are not particularly satisfactory means of communication. They just disappear. And so you think you've sent information to the client, you can ask for a reg receipt or delivery receipt, but do you ever get anything back? Questionable. If it's in the client zone, you know it's in the client zone, you can see it and the end employer can see it, and it makes follow up a lot easier than the old fashioned way. Yeah, and that leads me on to something I wanted to ask you, Pete, or could you explain briefly, was we've recently had a version update, go live on this. In terms of, for us being able to see when a client has engaged with the client zone, could you just briefly touch on that update, please? Yeah. Before I do that, I'd like to discuss the, going back to what I said earlier about the problems and difficulties of the areas I work in. As everyone has been able to hear throughout this podcast, everyone's discussing recruitment and recruiters and their particular problem they have with the client zone. How clients don't engage with it, some do, some don't. What we put in it, how we work it, how the recruiters use it, no one's really thinking about or discussing the most important part of the client zone, the employers, because it is for them and how we satisfy their needs and moving on to fees. So the most important part, the most contentious part of recruitment is actually the fees paid. And I probably understand this by doing a lot of research and reading away from skills provision, that this is the area where people are unhappy because they feel that they don't get true value for money from the recruiter who just pedals off to LinkedIn, finds a few suitable people, slaps their cv down and then invoices can be very high amounts. So the client zone is part of this delivery of value for money by truly satisfying the needs of the employer, which we continually get on later into where it's going to be moving in the future, are improving the system based off internal and client feedback but never losing sight. This is their system. This is for our customers to use, this is for them to get the most benefits out of it, not internal, that's secondary. So in terms of what we've built at this moment in time is a traffic light system that when a client has downloaded documents, uploaded comments, been in their client zone and used it, we now receive instant alerts by way of what we call the recruitment system, which you got traffic light system in there for each task undertaking which gives a visual representation of activity within the client zone. There we go. I think that's a valid point and we probably haven't touched on that enough that it is for the employer's benefit. And the feedback that we've had is that they like the fact that it's all up together. I think it also, whilst it allows us to measure the accountability and ensure that employers are engaging it equally, is then good for them to be able to see what is coming and going from the recruitment's perspective. They can see where we've added comments, they can see where we've done certain tasks, they can also see, okay, they haven't added any new candidates. Let's see, is there anything wrong in the recruitment process? Do we need to change anything? And allows for there to be evidence that we can then further develop conversations and further move things forward that, okay, I can see that you don't like these three candidates. The feedback has all been the same based on X, Y and Z. Right. That helps educate us for continuing the recruitment process. Let's move forward now from the employer's perspective. The other benefit is being able to access the documents in a singular and efficient way, meaning that again, they can have everything up to date and be able to look at different things because it's all well and good. A candidate saying, oh, I have a bachelor's in whatever it may be. But being able to then also see that supporting documentation I think is also a real benefit that they can look at how something compares. Well, the other thing that we've noticed is that with a few major clients, they're actually using the client zone as part of their internal tracking system and use it as a means of the storage within the client zone that they can export the documentation to their own system should they desire to hire an individual. So it's very useful from that point of view rather than as they would have done in the past, having to go into something like Dropbox and export everything that way. Yeah, it definitely allows for that more collaborative environment for all involved. Now, in terms of feedback from all mean myself, Dan and Chris, we've already said some things, but in terms of what I feel about the client zone, if I was to give my top three things that I love about it, one, it's all up together. Two, it allows a chance for me to add not only the surface level information, such as a cv, but the additional documentation to fully present my candidate. And it also allows me as a point of reference. So number three for me, a point of reference for me to keep on top of employers and say, look, I can see you've not looked at this person. There's no comments. You might say you've looked at them, but I can't see that engagement. Please, can you look at them? And it gives me a chance to keep and try and move that recruitment process forward. Dan, what would you say are your top things that you think about the client zone? Well, first thing I am thinking of is the speed and security of data transmission between us as a recruiting company and our clients. As Chris said before, we were struggling with emails and using third parties as Dropbox and other tools to transfer more data to the clients, which were not possible on email. Emails sometimes are reaching to spam. Dropbox is not working properly. So I found this as an amazing transferring tool, a bridge, as I said, with the high security maintained by our IT specialists, that would be as a first. The second one will be the client comment zone. Now, this one should be looked as the window from the client, from the employer to us is the window where we are looking in the employer backyard, if you want to, to see their feedback on our work. And they also have to look on their side of window to us on our comment zone where we are adding those which you mentioned before, suitability, english level, and our own comments. And that's because before every cv, there is a person, and every person have more to show than they are putting in a cv or that is shown by documents. And this is what is written in that part. So these two points, I found them very strong. Brilliant. Thank you. Craig, what would you say doesn't necessarily have to be top three. Sorry for putting people under pressure, but what do you think is the USPs then? If you were to say, okay, this is why you should choose a client zone. Collaborative technology and something I don't think has been mentioned so far is they can collaborate internally to look at clients across candidates. You mean, sorry, candidates across the three or four decision makers that may be involved. So it centralizes that. I personally like adding scores on English and suitability because it forces you to make a critical judgment on what you actually think of the person. And if I was on the other end in receipt of such comments, I would look at them closely. So those are the two strengths that I would highlight. And obviously I'm going to turn this question to you, Pete, I appreciate that and rightly so. I don't necessarily want you looking at it necessarily from the recruiter's perspective or even maybe the employer's perspective. But what do you think are the strengths or the biggest selling points of utilizing and using skills provision and the client zone in turn value for money in comparison to other recruitment agencies, which is the mainstay justification of the fees. I believe that recruitment is all about online recruitment should be about the bells and whistles. Recruitment as a process is fairly simplistic, difficult, but it's not mentally challenging finding people for a role in processing wise, monstrous. But it's the bells and whistles that we're trying to produce, deliver, to differentiate. And you go and buy an Audi, a six basic model, you get x. What is the real drivable difference between that and the absolute top of the range? That's ten times more expensive. It's all the bling and the bells and whistles of the drivability factor is no difference. That's why I'm looking at upgrade of everything as we will get onto in this podcast. What I would like to do, Francesca, for a change, is I'd like to ask you a question and also your two counterparts. So ask all three of you one, a two part question, what is the weak areas? What do you see as the weaknesses? One weak area of the client zone and two on a scale of one to ten, one being there's a long way to go to finish the client zone and ten it is. So how far down the development track do you see it as we stand at this moment in time? Ten is finished. Can't be any better. And one hell of a long way to go yet. So there you go. So over to you guys, what are you weaknesses and how far down the development track do you think, which I'll come on to in depth later on. Are we with the client zone? All right, I will go first. Sorry, boys. Right, in terms of I'm actually going to give it the overall score where I think it is now. And then I'll answer the other question after. I would say I'd give it between a six and a seven, because I do think there's room for improvement. Now, obviously, I don't know the technical challenges in actual physically delivering certain things. But I obviously know that there are updates and things that we've talked about, Pete and modifications. So I know that there is improvements coming and updates that we want to make. For me, our current weakness is one of our strongest things that we have at skills provision is our profile system. And any candidate that registers their profile is then visible and can be seen by anyone looking from the outside on the system. And it's quite often how we get a lot of our inquiries is that people will come across, say a CNC machinist and be like, okay, I'd like to talk to this person currently, and I know this is coming, is that those profiles that people are creating are not transferring or being then visible when they make it all the way through to the client zone. And I do think it's a nice way of showing, again, it's another string to candidates bows where perhaps technology is not necessarily their forte and they don't necessarily have access to maybe the latest software as things go. So a profile for some can act as that cv or that way of introducing themselves. So I think having that as a tool and something that is visible for the clients I think is something that is personally missing. That would probably be my number one in terms of things. I think maybe just visually, maybe making it a little bit more jazzy and things like that, maybe with the suitability rating or scores, making them more of a slider setting. But I do often think, and I think we've had conversations off of the podcast about this. You can have all the bells and whistles and it can look all fancy and things, but how much do people necessarily take notice and how much value does it add to everyone that is involved? The recruiter, from a tool perspective, but also from the employer's perspective, looking in, if they look at a slider versus a number, does it really change the value to them? No, probably not. Maybe just the aesthetics. But beyond that, nothing has immediately come to mind. And spending a lot of my time around this system, I think that speaks volumes that there aren't necessarily huge things that I'm thinking, oh, do you know what, there's a major gap here. Chris or Dan? I don't know if either of you. Who wants to go next? Do you want to go first, Dan? No, Chris, I only a few poor, so will be the last one, right. I would agree with your overall rating. It's about a six or a seven, but we'd be lost without it. So I don't want to be critical that all systems can be improved. Looking at the way the market is going generally, it's becoming much more visual. People's time in consuming information seems to be getting shorter. If there could be improvements in the hosting of me, then that would be welcome. As Francesca alluded to, I don't think it will make a huge load of difference to the end result, but it would be nice to have apologies for the copy. Yeah, and the only other thing that has now just come to mind is perhaps for those larger organizations, is being able to have multiple logins for different clients. Having a shared login there's no problem. But say there are different wings within a business. That would be the only other thing I could think of. Dan, you've had long enough to store and think it is over to you. Yeah, well, as a note, I will be more generous than you too. And I will give it an eight. I will give it an eight because it gives the exact thing the clients, the employers need, a window, a bridge to our work, an inside view to our work. Now, if it will need to be improved, I think that everything can be improved, and I really mean everything. But do we need or do we don't need that improvement? Do the client require those improvements or it's just something fancy in our mind that it will look better for our own, not for them. So improvement is something very you can talk about for 4 hours. On the other side, the weaknesses I can found. The one weakness which I can found for the client zone specifically, probably, I am not sure of it is the presentation of the candidates documents and video can be done in a more specific way. For now, it's just a list. You have the CV, and under the CV you have all the other documents. Probably a list, yes, but in a separate tab where the employer should see specifically and should go specifically for this, not to search. Okay, which one is this? What is this? And so on. And the video? Probably a video player inside the client zone. But this is just small adjustment, not really urgent necessarily right now. So for the moment, I think the client zone is perfectly working. The entire recruitment system might need some small adjustment, but is working out. There you go, Pete, that gives you some answers. What would you score it then? Eleven. Okay, right. Thank you. Some interesting answers there. And taking some notes while you've been talking. So what do I score it? I score it as 2.5. And the main weakness of the client zone, which has already been mentioned by Chris, is the fact that some people don't engage with it, which is obviously the number one element that we need to break down and so everyone, regardless of computer skills it skills, can't be bothered. It works in a different way that we start breaking it down. What I can do now, we probably jump forward a little bit, but the reason for the 2.5, which may be quite a differential between you guys, is probably down to what's coming next as opposed to what's balanced against what's in place at this moment in time. To cover some of this, I'll go through my list, which we have the introduction of various manpower streams, which will be a way of us pushing forward clients that are slightly suitable, possibly suitable, or on paper unsuitable for specific tasks. When you say clients, did you mean candidates? Sorry? Yeah, candidates. When measured against job description. So my son works in the oil and gas. On paper, he's not suitable for the job he's on at this moment in time, probably because there wasn't many people wanting to go and do it and now he's out there and his boss has said you'll be coming with me on all my jobs next year because you are so good. This kind of thing where the on paper candidates can't, which is a massive thing in recruitment that having various streams for clients to deliberate over, the next one being the uploading of interviews, pre interviews, and as we say, where different departments can be involved in terms of audio, video formats, photo albums, showcasing talents via way of image availability, availability. So when workers can start, actually start their start date, start time in a visible format, the use of QR codes, ease of use for employees so they can bang a QR code for their client zone and then on their mobiles at a later date start using it, going through just ease of use skills provision. Help based videos, one of Chris's favorites. So that we start breaking down the barriers for we don't want to use. I don't want to say, but I'm not really good at this kind of thing. So we help show them how to. It isn't anything to be frightened of and it will help them. Licensing by way of software downloads for individual or individual internal use. Large companies could get a lot out of a modified version of the client zone. Internally, 500 workers in ten sites, very difficult to manage. Just the manpower, not the recruitment, the manpower and the client zone is perfect for that with some modification, enhanced security and the introduction of teams, something like that, which would. They're small boxes for the communication, for two way communication. But it could be that this needs to be expanded on into larger documented typed conversations and that's just not possible at this moment in time. Now that's the first level and then there are other levels after that in terms of where I'm thinking about possibly not definitely moving with the client zone into all these areas. So what you see is that this. Wow, we. There's a hell of a lot there, what we probably not even thought about. And that comes down to not considering recruitment, not being too biased about recruitment and recruiters. Because if I go through this introduction of manpower streams. Yes, that's recruitment based. Probably more from being around you guys and understanding the problems you have. Introduces that idea. Uploading videos, similar to what Dan said when he was on about videos and all this kind of stuff. So having the interviews there. Yeah, photo albums. Chris has mentioned that before. Previously, availability. No one's ever mentioned that. QR codes. No one's ever mentioned that. Help based videos. Chris has always mentioned that. Licensing software downloads, no one's even thought of that. Although Chris had mentioned that it's suitable in its current format, internal use, which. Yeah, I guess so. Enhanced security. Dan mentioned that earlier. And teams collaboration, don't think that's been talked about before. So a lot of stuff on my list is a sort of 50 50 thing there of my best work comes from not being too close to you guys and then some of it comes from being very close to you guys. I have to be sort of split personality at times because the system is not for you. If it was for you, I need to be fully aligned to you. But where it's not, maybe like profiles as well. I have to be on the side of the people that don't have a voice internally at schools provision, which is the employers and the job seekers candidates. There you go. I just like to talk briefly about the job seeker. I realize that this isn't necessarily what we're talking about in terms of the client zone, but the job seekers do benefit from the client zone because they get a much wider exposure through the client zone than they would from just bunging in a cv to a recruitment company or completing a profile. And if you say the apparent match of a candidate is at the four or five level out of ten to start with, by building up the supporting documentation, you can very often get it up to a seven or an eight type level and strongly recommend, you know, everybody does benefit from the client zone, whether it's a direct benefit or an indirect benefit. Because whilst you say, Pete, that the client zone isn't obviously directly necessary to benefit us, it does benefit us because it's a tool, as with most things we discuss on these podcasts, anything related to the process or any of the processes that we do. It is just one of our tools in our belt that allows us to undertake and support either the job seekers finding jobs or the employers finding candidates. So it is very much a tool in our arsenal. Are there any other things that people want to add about the future or any other things that they'd like to see with the client zone? If not, we ticked off a lot of things on my list in terms of the content for this podcast. I must admit we covered that quite quickly. What about you dan, anything else that you want to add? Well, I think all that has been added is completing the entire image of client zone. Pete, from your perspective, is there anything else you'd like to add? I'd like to introduce end of task surveys in terms of feedback from the employers hr as to, and probably not just on the client zone in terms of areas that we can always looking to improve on. The client zone will be massive and will continue to be developed upon and will probably come the end of it, be one of the leading bits of software within international recruitment because I just don't see other people, one, being bothered two, seeing the value of these things because I think it's all fee based. You look at the PLCs that we have in the UK, it's profit, it's revenue, and it's driving them about their pay per clicks. They really would be struggling because they never worked on the differentiation of how can we be better ourselves and how can we truly support the employer? Not from the recruiter standpoint, which is what the client zone is, but they're good discussions and good areas to discuss. Certainly for me to get feedback from the recruiter side and start getting it from the clients, from the users via way of surveys, if anybody will ever fill them in and just keep them moving forward. Maybe a good idea in a year or two to run this podcast again and see where we are at with the client zone and the journey forward. No, I agree. The one thing I will finish with is that if you like to see more, because as I say, I appreciate that this is an audio experience, but if you are an employer and you want to see more and see more about what skills provision is, and client zone is just part of that, and how we can help you with your recruitment needs or hiring needs, please don't hesitate to contact us using one of the forms on our website which links will be in the description for this podcast in the relevant areas. But from me, Francesca, it's goodbye. And from Chris. Thank you for your time. Apologies for the coughing and goodbye. I enjoyed the stalling of Dan earlier. That was class. Goodbye. Don't forget to, like, share and subscribe. And from me also. Until next time, just don't forget to subscribe, like and share to skills revision. Take care everyone. See you on the next episode.